60 gallon acrylic - the saga begins

[psykokid]

so i picked up a 60 gallon acrylic a few weeks ago with a canopy and stand for a song. Tank hand some old sand sitting in it and a bunch of old coraline algae on the back panel. Also, the front panel has some small scratches on the inside, the deepest just barely catches my fingernail. There is a small jagged scrape/gouge on the outside of the front panel as well, about .125 of an inch wide and about 1.5 inches long.

Last night i cleaned most of the old sand and then filled up the tank with water to make sure there were no leaks. I added some vinegar to loosen the residual coraline on the back panel as well and let it soak for a few hours. Came out later and lightly scrubbed all the interior panels with an acrylic scrubber doohickey. I got the majority of it all off and then used a hose to vacuum out the rest of the residual sand from the bottom of the tank as i was re-draining it. So now after cleaning it all up and making an assessment the tank is overall good nick. The acrylic panels could be a little thicker, as they are only 1/4" and when the tank is full the front and rear panels tend to deflect a bit due to the lack of overall thickness of the panels. Nature of the beast i guess. The dimensions are 48Lx15Wx18H with bracing on the top. The front panel and sides are all one piece, as the corners on the front are bends and not seams.

So where to start on the scratches? What products to start out with? Any good techniques i should be aware of?

Danke,

Jake

[Bergy]

about time you got off your butt.... lazier then me, i tell ya


your tank sounds like a 'clear for life' tank...  they are built excptionally well, and yes, they will bow a little bit in the middle of the front and back... the brace SHOULD keep it from bowing on the top..???

Bascially from what I have read, it is not difficult, but it is time consuming... 

But, TRI/pga7602 over on scnrs  did it and his scratch was a GOOD one...

basically you use wet/dry paper, the black stuff, and just work your way up on the grit factor...

that is, start off with 180g  and sand in the same direction of the scratch.... and just sand about the width of your finger...  maybe two finger width wide....

then jump up to 320g, then finer and finer, each time you go up in grit, double the width of the area....

for keeping it wet, you can do it two different ways... just keep a spray bottle and spray every so often, or you can put an inch or so of water in the tank and just keep the sandpaper wet all the time...  the water will also help hold the tank dow so it isnt moving around on ya...


you should end up with grit in the 2000-3000 range





then after that is all done you can go over it with rubbing compound, or i have some of that stuff made specifically for acrylic... cant recall the name of it right now...     meds in the afernoon, AFTERNOON DELIGHT

The process would probably take a pro about 1-2 hours...  it would take me ALL DAY... It might take you about 4 hours MAX, depending on if you can put full time effort into it, or if you get sidetracked...                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   

If there is a specific day you want to do this, let me know, and if you want, i can come over for some moral support...

I also have some scrap acrylic you can experiment with ????

make a scratch all the across the scrap, then only prep/repair half of the scratch



let me know

[Just_Greg]

i've done an entire tank before (the 100 gal), and regular wet-dry is too coarse.  there's some wet-dry polishing cloth called "crystal bond" that is much better for polishing tanx, and i'd start with 1500 and start going finer from there.  once you hit 8000, you can either use a polishing slurry on a buffer (i used an electric car buffer) or go to 12,000 grit (i only use the 12k if i have to polish a tank while it's running).

i don't recommend polishing the same direction as the scratch for this reason:

if you polish at a 90* angle to the scratch, you can easily see when the scratch is gone before changing grits.  when the scratch is gone, polish the "old" scratches frm the previous grit at 90*, and repeat with each change in grit.  this way, you'll never have large scratches to polish out that would have been easier with the previous grit size.

i recommend Novus 2 and Novus 3 as the polishing slurries.

when i ran the failure analysis lab, i used to perform microsectioning on electronic components that had to be PERFECT, and this is the method i used (the 90* thing).

HTH

[Bergy]

yea, NOVUS is the name of the stuff


and yes also to changing dirction each time you change grits, but i thought i recalled starting off in the same direction... but, the way greg describes it, makes sense...

Also, im not familiar with the sanding cloth, but, if it is better, and greg would know, as he seems to have used both, then great... it sounds like it will last longer too, not that that should be an issue with just one tank..

keep in mind, i have not done this... I am just going by memoryfrom what i read years ago...and as some of you know, my memory is prolly the worse/worst thing about me taking meds... (both kinds)

i've done an entire tank before (the 100 gal), and regular wet-dry is too coarse.  there's some wet-dry polishing cloth called "crystal bond" that is much better for polishing tanx, and i'd start with 1500 and start going finer from there.  once you hit 8000, you can either use a polishing slurry on a buffer (i used an electric car buffer) or go to 12,000 grit (i only use the 12k if i have to polish a tank while it's running).

i don't recommend polishing the same direction as the scratch for this reason:

if you polish at a 90* angle to the scratch, you can easily see when the scratch is gone before changing grits.  when the scratch is gone, polish the "old" scratches frm the previous grit at 90*, and repeat with each change in grit.  this way, you'll never have large scratches to polish out that would have been easier with the previous grit size.

i recommend Novus 2 and Novus 3 as the polishing slurries.

when i ran the failure analysis lab, i used to perform microsectioning on electronic components that had to be PERFECT, and this is the method i used (the 90* thing).

HTH

[Just_Greg]

the polishing paper i used is the same stuff that's in one of the buffing kits, but you can buy it from Rockler's Woodworking  stores or the equivalent.

OT:

Bill, i've called you a few times, just to check up on you, but maybe you've been napping and haven't heard the phone.

[Bergy]

oh crap...

I did call you back last week, but you called like two days ago if i recall, and i was going to call you back but got sidetracked...

sorry...

Call me at your leisure.. i will make sure i answer...

hehehe

note to self, go to living room, get phone and come back to puter...

[psykokid]

i know the regular wet dry stuff is way too coarse for the scratches on the inside.. you can barely feel them with your finger nail. I'll check out rockler and see what buffing papers they have. I also found this kit referenced from REEFNAZI http://micro-surface.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=272_4_77_93&products_id=73 which doesnt look too bad.

Im wary against using power tools to do the job for the first time mostly because it can all go horribly wrong really quickly if its not something you have done before. The prospects of doing it by hand arent too terribly appealing either, I can already feel my arms getting tired. Id rather be safe than sorry.. Bill, do you still have any of that Novus 1-2-3 kit left that you picked up from that one guy?

After looking around i have come to the conclusion that my tank was MFG'd by Seaclear, as Clear For Life has square corners on most of their tanks where as Seaclear has rounded front corners.

I've done wet sanding on cars before so you learn the benefits of making sure that you are going one way with one grit and the opposite way with the next grit real quick..

[Bergy]

there shouldnt be any difference between the 'wet/dry' stuff and anything else when it comes to GRIT

trust me, once you hit the acrylic with anything less then 3000  it will turn the acrylic opaque...  You will want to cry and shoot yourself and say, wtf was i thinking....

but as you work your way up the grit ladder the haze/courseness issues will dissapear...


as for the sanding cloth... Im guessing it is just going to last longer and get into corners better...

and please dont use a maching, until you get to the buffing stage.. but even then, make sure you dont bang or gouge the acrylic... heheheheh  i mean  :(


i got the novus from bulkreefsupply to try to fix the tank at the dispensary i go to, but it needs full blown sanding...

so, I only used a smidgen of it...

and yes you can have it... I will grab it out of the garage after this message and put it on the table near the door...



and also, what about the ps2 and also any movies, (that arent listed on ebay..)

I wish i would have had you pick that stuff up when you were here


I will also grab some scrap acrylic... I will find one that has scratches on it already, but would want you to recreate a similar size/depth on the sample to try it first...

after you do it once it let you relax...

that was what i did when i drilled holes my aquarium a few years back...

sounds tougher/harder/less then optimistic, until you actually do it the first time


 

[Just_Greg]

"micro-mesh" was the other name i was trying to remember...

i did my "rough" polishing by hand, and the buffing with the auto buffer, which you're welcome to borrow if needed.  once you're on the slurry, you want even, random polishing as opposed to linear polishing.

i forgot to add, altho it sounds like you're not a noob to polishing things, work in small, manageable sections.  i was at work, and Renee had gotten industrious and decided to remove some scratches, and hit like half the tank with the 1500 grit, got in over her head, and stopped.  and yes, indeed, the tank was a hazy, scary thing...

anywho, this is a job i'll try not to repeat as it's tedious as hell, but if done correctly, looks super.  however, i do have a 65T that needs a bit of buffing...someday, when i decide to set up a tank for garden eels, i'll have to get cracking.

[Bergy]

yea, basically, dont sand areas that dont need it... you want to start off in a small area, just a finger width wider then the scratch... keep it small, then double the area and move to a finer grit...the technique is similar to working with drywall, and taping... by the time you tape and float the 'mud' the area is about 2-3 feet wide, the idea is to not make the surface flat, but rather smooth, and over a larger area... so it doesnt appear or feel like a bump or divit

It is a smoke and mirrors thing...

Chances are if you put a straight edge over the surface, you will see the gap in teh center.. possible deep enough to slide a match book cover under

And yea, micro mesh is a brand name, and it is a mesh.. i have seen it but never used it...Im not real sure it makes a big difference, but it will get in those rounded corners much better, although the paper sandpaper will become smooth and flexible too...

either way, im sure by the time you fix the scrap piece of acrlic, you will be another acrylic expert...

If you want, i can bring the scrap to your place on monday or tuesday.. I have two different dr's appointments on those days...  and can swing by and drop stuff off, either before or after.. lmk

[psykokid]

i was gonna come by tonite if you're going to be up. I'm going to try the novus stuff in the corner and see if i can get away with using just that. The one on the outside im not too terribly concerned with as it can be addressed any time after the tank is up and running. Anyhow i'll ring you before popping in.

[Bergy]

yea, im home all night.. just give me a call when you are on your way..

I dont think the novus will do anything other then to really clean the acrylic well


but, you can try

[Just_Greg]

the mesh polishing media doesn't load up as fast, but IME, the other stuff does fine if just keep it wet enuff so the dust washes away.  gotta love spray bottles...

[Bergy]

GREG,

CALL ME  please

[psykokid]

well, progress is slow. sanding by hand sucks bullocks. There is someone on reef nazi that is really close to me that is selling a 60 gallon glass with stand and sump. I may just pick it up and then do whatever with the acrylic, maybe wait until i get an oribtal sander/buffer and clean it up proper like or make a big You better mean it as in 'donkey' sump/fuge out of it. I wont feel bad if i go that route since i only paid 10 bucks for the acrylic tank and stand.